cold start removal

[745 TurboGreasel]

Originally Posted by jpliddy

when you say if something is not set up correctly and will need to be set up on a test bench .
does that mean removing the injection pump from the car ,
and thats where the high costs come in ?
regards
jim liddy

That doesn't include the cost of removing and replacing the pump on the car, I do that part myself, and forget not everyone does.

[jpliddy]

hi volvo8
i can send some pictures to your email address if thats ok.
there is no movement in the C.S. device hot or cold so the photos
i can send will be how its set up now this would hopefully give you a chance to see what is set up .
regards
jim liddy

[ngoma]

Try including your photos in the thread like this:P1000754.jpg

That way a larger audience may be more helpful to you!

Here's how:

1. Start your Reply to Thread

2. Scroll down the screen to see the section titled "Additional Options"

3. Click the button "Manage Attachments"

4. Click the "Browse" button

5. Navigate to where your photos are stored on your computer, select the desired photo (have to do one at a time)

6. Click the "Upload" button

7. Go back to the "Reply to Thread" screen

8. Click the paper clip button next to the smiley face on the top row of icons

9. Find your photo filename there in the list and click it P1000754.jpg Whoomp! there it is!

There, all done in under ten steps!

NOTE: This presumes your photos are on your computer.

Looking forward to seeing your photos and hoping this gets you some good progress in the right direction.

[jpliddy]

thanks ngobe
i will try this as not done it before
regards
jim liddy

[v8volvo]

Originally Posted by 745 TurboGreasel

That doesn't include the cost of removing and replacing the pump on the car, I do that part myself, and forget not everyone does.

It's not too hard to set the CS system up on the car; you don't really have to have it done on the bench. Almost none of the pump rebuilders are able to actually do that properly anymore at any rate. I've had to set it in more than one case where the CS cable broke and all the bits at the end were lost, not that tricky, you just have to make sure to do the final setting on a hot, running motor so that you know you have reached full extension of the plunger, and make sure it backs all the way off to zero advance under those circumstances and the advance position and idle speed when cold are within reason. I usually also like to set it so that the ball stud's well backed away from the roller cage when warm, but the lever stop is placed where there's still a fingernail's width of clearance between the lever and the tab. Keeping a little bit of return spring tension on the cable when the system is in "warm" position, rather than letting the lever hit the stop and the cable go fully slack, seems to make life easier on the cable since it doesn't let it wag around so much.

I've also tweaked that setting in a few cases where the t-stat isn't completely dead, but is dying and doesn't fully back off the advance anymore -- you can get a little more life out of them by changing the adjustment a bit, since the t-stat usually dies a gradual death where the displacement of the plunger slowly falls off over time. During the time before it quits moving altogether you can still get some use out of it. Unless the weather's really cold you don't generally need the full-on effect anyway, the system still is effective even if its total travel is reduced a bit.

However, this all doesn't change the fact that there is no reason to mess with it except for in a specific case... just replacing the t-stat should not require any adjustment (except sometimes I move the stop back a bit for the reasons above). The whole system shouldn't be touched with anything except for a flathead screwdriver unless it's by a person who knows exactly what they are trying to do and why.

Overall, though, I would trust someone who had never worked on this stuff before to be able to set the CS device adequately from scratch, after disturbing that setting, much more readily than I would trust them to correctly remove and reinstall the IP, plus trusting an injection shop that hasn't seen this setup in 15 years to get the cold start set up right.

[745 TurboGreasel]

I won't deny you could get it close, and my old wore out junk starts fairly easy motor at freezing 27F ambient without having any CS device at all, so I'm not sure how much it even matters.

[ngoma]

+1^^^ (745 TurboGreasel)

[Boots]

Hi Guys,

jpliddy emailed me these pics and asked me to post them up here:

[745 TurboGreasel]

OK, so it is engaged to the cable, in the cold starting position, and affecting idle speed. This is how things should be for a cold start.
Presumably this means the picture was taken with the engine cold.
This should result in an easy start, high idle, and increased engine clatter. at lower RPMs

Million dollar question is; Does anything change when the car is warm?
Specifically, the timing advence lever should move back to rest on the stop, and the cold idle ballstud should retreat way from the downward tab on the throttle arm, accompanied by idle decreasing from ~1200 to ~800RPM.

If the pictures were taken with the engine at operating temperature, there is a 98% chance the wax stat is inoperative, and a 1% chance of a horribly botched adjustment.

[jpliddy]

hi 745 turbo greasel
well this is how i got car back from diesel men .
there is no movement in cold stat cable this all stays the same hot or cold .
lots of blue smoke on start up but goes after short time when engine is hot . idle speed at start up about 650 rpm . then climbs to 800 ish when engine is hot
so this is what i have done i wanted the advance lever closer to the stop on I.P. so i undid the screw and 10mm nut so i could get the cold stat in the disconnect position .
i know i should not have done this but i did not like the thought of the pump being in permanent advance i have read various comments . like COLD STAT NEVER WORKED and ADDVANCED TIMEING CAN HURT ENGINE OVER TIME. and ABOVE 2500 RPM ADDVANCE DOES NOT MATTER . so just hope I'm not in to much trouble with you guys as .
i need to get this blue smoke/ low RPM on start up fixed soon thanks boots for posting my photos .
would you guys trust diesel men they tell me what should be happening and blame it all on cold start device .
do you agree as I'm sure its broke /failed