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-   -   Head Bolt Broke Off In Block (http://d24t.com/showthread.php?t=1816)

ngoma 10-01-2017 10:53 AM

Head Bolt Broke Off In Block
 
3 Attachment(s)
It was time to replace the head gasket on the 85 745. Too much oil was accumulating in the cooling system, and the oil leaking to the exterior was creating an enviromental problem. Otherwise the engine was running great, well worth a head gasket change. It is my mileage king, giving a consistent 35 MPG avg. city/highway mix.

One of the head bolts snapped off during removal. #9 in this diagram.


We tried penetrating oil, chisel, propane torch heat, drilling, ez-out. Now want to try the fill-it-with-weld and weld a nut to it method. Since I don't have welding equipment and no experience I will see if a mobile welder can do it.

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R.Mojica 10-17-2017 04:17 AM

there isn't anything to weld to. might be better off drilling it all the way out or sending it to a machine shop.

ngoma 10-17-2017 10:37 PM

Yes that appears to be the case. I decided I will need to drill it out and install a Time-Sert. Just have to figure out how to keep the drill centered and perpendicular.

RedArrow 10-18-2017 05:00 PM

How about some real "dentist's tools"?
Idk why but that came to my mind since space is very limited

anders 10-19-2017 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ngoma (Post 12231)
Yes that appears to be the case. I decided I will need to drill it out and install a Time-Sert. Just have to figure out how to keep the drill centered and perpendicular.



I would use an old cylinder head as a drill guide. It will the keep the drill bit centered and true.

ngoma 10-20-2017 09:56 AM

Yeah I thought about that. Makes sense. Now just have to find an old head laying around!

My other thought was to grind out the bolt remains from the first few threads, then run a bottoming tap thru to try clean out the rest.

Hendo 10-20-2017 04:36 PM

As you know, I'm not much of a mechanic so I'm hesitant to offer advice.

BUT.... You can probably fab a drill guide out of aluminum bar stock... use one of the other head bolts to hold it in place.

Drill-press accuracy is probably good enough. But any machine shop (or DIYer) ought to be able to make one for you for not much cash. They could do a steel one easier than you can at home on a drill press.

Use an oversize hole at the clamping bolt so you have some wiggle-room.

Maybe try an undersize drill bit. Maybe even a left-handed bit if you can find one.

Good luck and let us know how it goes!

ngoma 11-02-2017 02:53 PM

2 Attachment(s)
I ordered the Time-Sert kit m12 x 1.75 x 30mm.
The hole is just under 30mm deep below the counterbore (on the one I measured, assuming they are all the same depth). The flange of the insert will probably stand at least 6mm proud of the counterbore base since the insert cannot be installed to the bottom of the hole. The included tap is not a true bottoming tap so cannot thread to the bottom of the hole.

Dremel should be able to cut off the protuding section of the insert.

Our drilling session attempt at extracting the remains of the broken-off bolt managed to get the drilled hole off-course by 1-2mm (toward the IP side)-- hoping there is enough slop in the gasket and head's bolt holes to allow for this when reinstalling.

One great tip from Time-Sert: Cover the block deck with packing tape (like that wide clear tape for taping up cardboard boxes) to make a kind of "dental dam" to protect the oil ports, cylinder bores, etc. from metal chips and other foreign matter during drilling and tapping operations.

That's where we are at now, after cleaning up the other bolt holes and the steam port holes that were packed solid around #5.

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ngoma 11-07-2017 10:48 AM

Got the Time-sert thread repair kit installed. That got me thinking about the 12mm deep counterbores for each hole. Does anybody know the reason? Why don't the threads start right at the block deck instead of 12mm below the surface?

v8volvo 11-08-2017 10:46 AM

Maybe something having to do with distortion of the block deck if the threads start too near the surface?

ngoma 11-10-2017 06:30 PM

2 Attachment(s)
Yes that does make sense. I am remembering something about the early 1.5 blocks with 11mm headbolts suffering from cracks around the bolt holes.

More progress:

Chased/cleaned the bolt holes

Cleaned up the block deck. I really like that super scraper.

Cleaned up the piston tops and measured piston protrusion with a small stout straightedge and feeler gauges:

#1 .026
#2 .016
#3 .034
#4 .032
#5 .034
#6 .032

What's up with outlier #2? No signs of valve collision on piston top.

Looks like I go with 2-notch head gasket, here are the specs:
mm (in)
0.81-0.90 (0.032-0.035) 2-notch
0.91-1.02 (0.036-0.040) 3-notch

It had a 3-notch replacement gasket. I think repair shops commonly replaced head gaskets w/ 3-notch across the board. Easier to stock one gasket version, and no having to measure/ no chance for valve interference. The tradeoff is lower performance.

Here are photos of the piston tops. Can anyone decipher the markings?
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ngoma 03-09-2018 05:02 PM

Significant milestone today
 
Took advantage of a day off (mostly) and good weather and marked a significant milestone today. I had previously cleaned up the block deck and cylinder head mating surfaces, and bolt holes, and installed the 2-notch head gasket, cylinder head, oiled and torqued the new head bolts, + the additional 180 deg (they want a continuous motion on that, which was hard to manage until I put the pipe on the 24" breaker bar. Then it was an easy walk around the front of the car to the other side :D.) The head bolt in the Time-sert repaired bolt hole seemed to act similar to the others-- time will tell how well it holds up. Still have two more 90deg bolt tightening procedures to go: one after first warm-up, the other after 600-1200 miles.

Then belts, camshaft and IP timing.

Today I was able to bolt up the exhaust manifold and install the injector lines.

Still trying to figure out the best way to clean out the clingy oil gunk mess inside the whole cooling system, so the radiator is still out of the car and the hoses are not connected.

But I looked at it then and thought: "It could start as it is, right now." Cranked and cranked until fuel came out of the loosened #1 injector line. Energized the GPs and it started and idled by itself :D until I shut it off because no coolant. I had to try several times :D and it did start easily each time.

ngoma 03-31-2018 07:09 PM

Almost there!
 
After the 3-day sump-pump-in-a-bucket-plumbed-into-the-cooling-system flush to remove the oil and oil residue from the cooling system it was time to hook the rest back up.

Valve clearances checked out within spec.

Attached the PS pump, vac pump, air cleaner and its piping, radiator, overflow tank, etc.

Drove around the neighborhood a few times to get it up to operating temp., then gave the second-to-last 90deg. headbolt tightening.

Greenbook says "Tighten bolt 90* Note this should be in one movement without stopping." Even with lots of extension pipe on the breaker bar it felt like a slow motion jackhammer. No way to get a smooth twist on those!

The Time-sert repaired hole felt about the same as the others so I am taking that to mean its threads are successfully holding so far. The one directly ahead of it however tightened like butter, instead of chattering and crackling like the others. :confused:

Finished up too late to get the plates re-registered, so will have to wait until Monday for more reportage.

neilsontom3000 05-03-2018 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ngoma (Post 12430)
Took advantage of a day off (mostly) and good weather and marked a significant milestone today. I had previously cleaned up the block deck and cylinder head mating surfaces, and bolt holes, and installed the 2-notch head gasket, cylinder head, oiled and torqued the new head bolts, + the additional 180 deg (they want a continuous motion on that, which was hard to manage until I put the pipe on the 24" breaker bar. Then it was an easy walk around the front of the car to the other side :D.) The head bolt in the Time-sert repaired bolt hole seemed to act similar to the others-- time will tell how well it holds up. Still have two more 90deg bolt tightening procedures to go: one after first warm-up, the other after 600-1200 miles.

Then belts, camshaft and IP timing.

Today I was able to bolt up the exhaust manifold and install the injector lines.

Still trying to figure out the best way to clean out the clingy oil gunk mess inside the whole cooling system, so the radiator is still out of the car and the hoses are not connected.

But I looked at it then and thought: "It could start as it is, right now." Cranked and cranked until fuel came out of the loosened #1 injector line. Energized the GPs and it started and idled by itself :D until I shut it off because no coolant. I had to try several times :D and it did start easily each time.



Hey Ngoma,

Just saw this thread, did you manage to get things sorted?...I had a similar bit of confusion re the head bolt torque specs when fitting a 3 notch Elring MLS (btw it was a 2 notch on it, but went with the 3 notch as it proved easier/cheaper to source, was also told it would raise compression slightly, which I didnt see as a bad trade off)

I eventually emailed Elring and this was the reply...

http://i63.tinypic.com/zvtmyv.jpg[/IMG]


Also had to put a big breaker bar/scaffold tube onto it to get the 180 degree final stage on them.

Cheers.

neilsontom3000 05-03-2018 04:51 AM

Sorry the image I uploaded, chopped of the end of it which just shows the NO.4 torque procedure...i.e 180 degree final turn.

Cheers.

ngoma 05-03-2018 10:18 AM

Engine is now running quite nicely, about half way to the 600-1200 mi. final 90deg bolt tightening. The Time-sert repaired bolt hole is apparently holding, no leaks internal or external from the HG, coolant is clean and clear.

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilsontom3000 (Post 12543)
(btw it was a 2 notch on it, but went with the 3 notch as it proved easier/cheaper to source, was also told it would raise compression slightly...

Think it's the reverse-- thicker HG reduces compression. You may find harder starting, less power, economy, etc. I agree the MLS HG has a different torque specs and procedure than the fiber HG. Also more stringent mating surface finish specs. Along with theoretically better longevity.

neilsontom3000 05-03-2018 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ngoma (Post 12545)
Engine is now running quite nicely, about half way to the 600-1200 mi. final 90deg bolt tightening. The Time-sert repaired bolt hole is apparently holding, no leaks internal or external from the HG, coolant is clean and clear.


Think it's the reverse-- thicker HG reduces compression. You may find harder starting, less power, economy, etc. I agree the MLS HG has a different torque specs and procedure than the fiber HG. Also more stringent mating surface finish specs. Along with theoretically better longevity.

Nice one, glad you got it sorted ;)

Still not turned the key yet on mine after the head re-build, my new idler pulley bolt snapped whilst being torqued up , tried an easy-out, which felt like it was also about to let go , so eventually decided to drill it out and tapped it to 8mm and all seems to be strong.

Been out the country since for past couple of months, but now have a bit of a free time ahead, so hopefully i'll finally get the thing going shortly.

re the thicker HG, I hope it doesn't affect the car too adversely in that case, as i don't think I could face doing the bloody job again :mad: i'll soon know!

cheers.


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