Jason's "pro vent" oil seperator, for $200 less than the Mann system!

[Jason]

After getting some imput and suggestions, and trying a couple different ways of routing the CCV, it became apparent that there was no way to run it other than back into the intake unless you want a big mess, and annoying white smoke and smell! To help keep my future intercooler from becoming coated in oil, a oil seperator or catch can was in order. My only problem with just the catch can is the amount of oil this engine blows out in the upper RPMs. I run my car pretty hard, so this is a decent amount. I didn't want to have to deal with draining it all the time, and also the oil being dumped out is that much more you have to add back to the engine.

Here are a few pictures of the oil seperator with drain that I designed. This is a maintenance free system, as extra collected oil drains back into the engine. Also there is no filter to have to clean or replace. Not saying its as effective is the Mann provent for example, but I expect it should cut down on the amount of raw oil going into the intake by at least 75%. There is still going to be the misty smoke, but if you want to get rid of that you would need the $200+ Mann system. I only paid $1500 for the whole car...

Here are the parts layed out, I used a 6" long piece of 2.5" exhaust pipe, two VW gas caps (from an air cooled vw bug gas tank), and three 3/4" dia pieces of tubing. Two for the seperator and one to plumb into the intake. Also up in the corner are two universal valve cover vents I had laying around. Not pictured is a small piece of sheet metal that fits inside the tubing to be used as a baffle.
http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af168/vwjunkie53/000_0050.jpg

The next order of business was finding a place for the oil to drain back to the block. At first I was thinking of tying into the turbo drain, but decided not to for a couple reasons. It is a nice braided stainless line, with crimped ends. Cutting into this was going to be a pain, plus I would have to find a large diameter "T" fitting of some kind. Also, this is on the opposite side of the engine. There is much more space on the drivers side to install the seperator. After looking around, I had the idea of tying into the dipstick tube... Its direct into the bock, and much bigger than the dipstick itself, so there wont be much restriction. There is only going to be a few drips of oil comming down at a time anyway. Here is a pic of the dipstick tube with dipstick in it, you can see all the extra clearence for oil to drain past:
http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af168/vwjunkie53/000_0051.jpg

Next, I drilled a hole in the tube and welded in one of the universal valve cover vents.
http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af168/vwjunkie53/000_0055.jpg

Next I welded on two pieces of the 3/4" tubing, opposite each other. I then welded a piece of sheet metal in the middle of the tube. It is flush at the top, and extends down to about an inch from the bottom of the seperator. That way the oil blow by is going to run into the baffle, and travel down to the bottom and back up the other side and out the vent. The blow by hitting the baffle should collect a decent amount of oil by itself hopefully.
http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af168/vwjunkie53/000_0056.jpg

Last, I welded on the the VW gas caps to close off the ends. These worked out great and with the VW logo stamped in the top, it looks like it could be original equipment. Mostly it was because I had them laying around! I also welded in the last valve cover vent into the bottom cap for the oil drain.
http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af168/vwjunkie53/000_0058.jpg

I ended up mounting it off the cruise controll bracket with a stainless clamp. After painting it black, it looks like it should be there... I'll post up some feedback after I drive it a few days and see what the intake looks like.
http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af168/vwjunkie53/000_0059.jpg
http://i1004.photobucket.com/albums/af168/vwjunkie53/000_0060.jpg

Jason

[lalozf]

cheap and looks nice, incredible.
I will write it on my wish list

[240diesel]

That looks good to me!
Nice detailing with the VW hub-cap on your VAG engine.

Few months ago i repaired a truck with broken down turbo, it blew 2 litres of engineoil into the intercooler.
I drilled 2 holes on each bottomside of the cooler 6,5mm to drain the cooler.
After that i made screwtread M8 in the holes and fixed the holes with 2 M8 bolts with copper rings between bolt and cooler.

(this method we use when the intercooler is a lot of work to de-mount and time is short in the night, otherwise we de-mount and flush the cooler)

[Jason]

Thanks,
its yet to be seen how well it works, but it looks cool having another VW logo in the engine compartment.

Jason

[v8volvo]

Looks great, very nice design and should work well.

I bet a lot of TDI and VW diesel guys would be interested in something like this. TDIs pump out a ton of oil into the intercooler and intake, people are always trying to modify the CCV system. This is pretty ingenious. You could probably turn a good profit making batches of these and selling them as kits on TDIclub...

Nice work.

[Jason]

Thanks,
I did a similar thing on my TDI, but with just a straight catch can. The TDI being a smaller engine has less blow by volume, and since its redline is 1000 rpm lower, even being run hard doesn't push that much oil. I only drained out maybe a 1/4 cup of oil from the catch can when I would do an oil change. The D24 on the other hand after a hard run has a decent drip comming from the tube (when i had it dumping on the ground... dont call the EPA on me) I'm still thinking of adding another oil seperator/vent to the valve cover..

I'm not so sure about selling them... I'm happy with the result but its not my best work. I threw this together in an evening of tinkering in the garage out of leftover junk!

Jason

[jbg]

Well done Jason. This is a very well thought out system. I do like the idea of it being a closed-circuit system and feeding the discarded oil back into the engine.

I'm sure you could address your own comment about catching the mist/vapor by adding some stainless steel mesh in there. Perhaps if you moved the sheet metal baffle back a bit towards the can's outlet you could fashion a place for the mesh to sit.

Regardless, this is a very trick design, kudos to you, sir.

[Jason]

I have found that draining into the dipstick tube wont work. I'll report back where I find to go with it next. It is just above the oil level so crank case blow by comes up the tube and carries oil with it. I found it was actually filling the canister with oil... It needs to drain back into the pan at the oil level. I'm thinking maybe making an adapter to extend the drain plug and dumping it in there. I still really dont want to cut into the turbo oil drain.

Jason

[Jason]

I ended up draining it into the oil pan at the oil level sender that didn't work anyway... I've never had a car with a oil level sender and didn't really care if it was there, I check my oil regularly anyway. Returning it there seems to work well.

Jason

[Eli]

I really like your set up. Especially the VW caps, very nice touch. I have been concerned about the oil in my intake/turbo for a long time now. I came to the same conclusion as you awhile ago to build a "catch can" that just drained the oil back into the pan.

Upon talking about this idea I was advised against it. Under the idea that there is more gunk in blow by then just oil, and you didn't want to drain that directly back into the pan.

As I repeat this now, it sounds kind of foolish. I mean, I don't know of any cars that came with catch cans from the factory. They all send the oil back to the pan somehow right? Either way it's not going into the intake/intercooler where you really don't want it.

Although I suppose I have heard some horror stories about what people find when they clean out their intercoolers with no catch can.

I am just wondering if there is any merit in this concern and if you have had any experience with extra gunk?

I have wanted to build something very much like that, but have been scared off so far by this idea.


Just a thought:
What about a better baffle system right on top of the valve cover, so that most of the oil never even got out of there in the first place? just drained right back in. Or even a better baffle inside the valve cover. Oh my.

Thanks,

-Eli

[IceV_760]

Maybe you could use same system than me.
Oil flows to oil separator, but never back to engine.
So its closed system, and pressure in motor will push gasses
there, dont fear. And in top of separator there is pipe and air filter
to keep gas flowing.

Really much like the oil separator systems sold in market.

[Jason]

Like a catch can, only problem is you have to drain it all the time... With the drain its self contained and I don't have to screw with it.

Jason

[v8volvo]

I really like your set up. Especially the VW caps, very nice touch. I have been concerned about the oil in my intake/turbo for a long time now. I came to the same conclusion as you awhile ago to build a "catch can" that just drained the oil back into the pan.

Upon talking about this idea I was advised against it. Under the idea that there is more gunk in blow by then just oil, and you didn't want to drain that directly back into the pan.

As I repeat this now, it sounds kind of foolish. I mean, I don't know of any cars that came with catch cans from the factory. They all send the oil back to the pan somehow right? Either way it's not going into the intake/intercooler where you really don't want it.

Although I suppose I have heard some horror stories about what people find when they clean out their intercoolers with no catch can.

I am just wondering if there is any merit in this concern and if you have had any experience with extra gunk?

I have wanted to build something very much like that, but have been scared off so far by this idea.


Just a thought:
What about a better baffle system right on top of the valve cover, so that most of the oil never even got out of there in the first place? just drained right back in. Or even a better baffle inside the valve cover. Oh my.

Thanks,

-Eli

I think the "gunk" you are referring to is probably sludge that forms when the oil is mixed with pressurized air and some exhaust soot, as it is on, for instance, a TDI with EGR. The oil mist coming out of the breather tube, if not mixed with other contaminants in the intake, should just be pure oil, and there is no reason not to send it straight back to the pan. Remember, from there it will get screened at the pickup then pumped through a filter anyway. If there is going to be some kind of gunk or crud in the stuff coming out the breather hose, better to send it straight into the pan than piping it into the intake side of the turbo, where it could chew up your vanes, get into the intake stream, etc.

In any case the truth is that the oil is not going to actually hurt anything whichever place it goes -- just it will create a big mess if you put it in your intake, especially if you have an intercooler too. The oil separator system prevents that. I'm sure the only reason no cars come with it from the factory is just because of the added complication and expense. ;) Plenty of big trucks come with them. It is an excellent way of dealing with oil vapor, especially on older engines that may produce a fair amount of it.

Eli, since your D24T is in a 240, you might have a nice option for a place to drain back to the sump -- just put it in the hole for one of your two dipsticks. :D

[Jason]

I too wouldn't take any stock in the the opinion that its going to be full of gunk. The blowby is comming from the valve cover to begin with, which is inside the engine already. You just returning back to where it came from. I think George is right, people that are saying that are confused with the EGR soot/sludge found in a TDI for example. Sorry but EGR just does not belong in a diesel engine!

Jason

[Eli]

Thanks guys, you have calmed my worries on this issue. Just in time too, I was about to buy a conventional catch can.

now I will build something like this for my car.

As for training it back into the second dipstick tube. Jason said he had problems with crank case pressure not letting it drain down. I might give it a shot, but I would like to develop something that sits on the valve cover and baffles it as it comes out.

We'll see what happens.

[Jason]

Ya it needs to drain back into the oil pan. If you drain it into the block above the oil level, you have blowby pressure in the block that trys to come up the tube and hinders the drain back. I ended up dumping into where the useless oil level sender was.

Jason