Power Steering Pump Mounting Bushings

[ngoma]

The power steering pump starts to vibrate a lot at approx. 1500 RPM. Looks like it is mounted on several rubber bushings. Does this indicate shot bushing mounts? Where do folks get them?

[cuaz64]

lots of places, you can get them from ipdusa.com, fcpgroton.com, tascavolvoparts.com....is a very long list, they use the same bushings as the gas engines. Another way is make aluminum or delrin replicas.

[ngoma]

Another way is make aluminum or delrin replicas.
Thanks, I think I will look into that; I remounted it with 3 new rubber bushings and the PS pump still vibrates, and is noticeably canted downwards and inwards towards the engine, making its pulley appear to be at a different angle in relation to the other pulleys.

[piper109]

The pumps always tend to vibrate. The rubber bushings deform and the belt becomes out of line.
The aluminum brackets have the tendency to break across one of the mounting holes too.

Steve

[Jason]

Ya with the vibration these engines have, i think I would stick with the rubber.

Jason

[RedArrow]

My steering pump vibrates a lot too but, I think, nothing abnormal (yet).
Although there`s a tiny leak very slowly developing in this area. A few thousand miles ago I started seeing the hose getting `shiny`. No steering problems so far and I haven`t had to add fluid (yet), the level is fine but there`s obviously something going on. I always see the hose being wet a little but the source of the leak is somewhere higher on the side where the belt runs (front of car). Then the fluid makes its way down on the assembly and down the hose to the ground, slowly but surely. A few drops a day. The cap seals tight and it`s dry around it.
Before anything else happens, I`d like to sort this out in time. I suspect that the mounting bushings are getting worn out, at least one or especially the top one. I would appreciate it if one of you d24t lovers could take a pic of yours so I will see how it supposed to look like there... The front `edge` of that upper bushing is out of the steering pump bracket 3-4millimeters, the nut on the other side is slightly sunk in and my belt is a bit out of alignment too, a few degrees (belt does not run perfectly straight, its angle is visible). Luckily this setup is quite far from the other pulley the belt runs on so this issue is not (yet) eating up the belt but it does twist on it at some point, I believe. To me it feels like the steering pump is dislocated a bit, tilted some and got closer to the front of the car, resulting the belt being tighter a bit (not crazy tight yet). ((This might* have an effect on the alternator as well which probably runs/works differently now, not in great harmony with other things around it... and maybe it`s to be blamed for making my voltage gauge stay in the upper zones all times.))
I just hate the feeling when something leaks on the car. Since I don`t want my alt bearing get toasted or my belt(s) fly off, plus perfect steering pump adjustments are also somewhat necessary, Please send me your suggestions on this topic. Oh btw I did hear a belt squeaking twice, first appr 4-5 weeks ago for 5sec when the car was cold started after driven through lots of rain and snow for hundreds of miles. Then I heard it only once more, for a second or two again, just a few weeks ago.
How much of a special skill or tools needed to complete this `project` replacing those mounting bushings? (or at least the one on top) What would be the procedure? Must DO-s and DON`T DO-s. Are there any adjustment possibilities on our steering pump brackets?
Thanks for reading. Feel free to see my Album under my name. Have a great day!

[v8volvo]

Sounds like the P/S pump mounting bushings are just getting worn. Easy to replace! Just don't remove the alternator bracket from the engine, as it is tricky to reinstall correctly.... removing the alternator from the bracket while leaving the bracket attached to the engine still leaves plenty of room to change the bushings.

The fluid leak is probably a separate issue, very often on these old power steering pumps the main O-ring that seals the pump housing to the reservoir gets tired and starts to leak after a while. Fortunately it is quite easy to get parts to fix it since the pump is made by GM (Saginaw) and is shared with many GM vehicles from the '70s and '80s, hence extremely common.... CarQuest sells a pump rebuild kit for under $20 that is applicable for the D24 power steering pump, part # 35039, and replacing the seals is relatively easy especially if you already are going to have the pump removed to replace the mount bushings.

Only tricky part really is dealing with the fluid mess (I usually use a fluid extractor to suck most of it out before disconnecting the hoses), and then getting the pump apart from the reservoir, you have to be sure to get all the bolts out and *also* the fitting that the pressure hose screws into, which doubles as a retaining nut for the reservoir.... once the two halves are separated it's just changing the O-rings and putting it back together. The kit comes with pump shaft bushings, etc as well but the pumps themselves seem to never have any issues at all, only the leaky seals so I have never used the bushings, I just clean it up, reseal it and all is fine. There's the one main O-ring and a few smaller ones around the bolts and pressure fitting, that's it. You could do it or virtually any good Volvo repair shop should be able to as well.

[RedArrow]

Thanks for your instructions! I`ll get to fixing it very soon. I am sure that my belt is not perfectly aligned by now so I`ll have to change the PS Pump mounting bushings. You mentioned alternator bushings as well... I suspect that the steering pump`s front seal is gone too (the pump does leak slowly) so I`ll have to add fluid for now and then find a nice afternoon with 35+ temps... I got confused at the car parts store about the proper power steering fluid. As far as I remember I always used some red/purple looking automatic transmission fluid (ATF) in our d24-s and not the regular power steering fluid. What type (F?) and what brand should I buy? Thanks for confirming.

[ngoma]

Dexron III.

[v8volvo]

Thanks for your instructions! I`ll get to fixing it very soon. I am sure that my belt is not perfectly alligned by now so I`ll have to change the PS Pump mounting bushings. You mentioned alternator bushings as well... I suspect that the steering pump`s front seal is gone too (the pump does leak slowly) so I`ll have to add fluid for now and then find a nice afternoon with 35+ temps... I got confused at the car parts store about the proper power steering fluid. As far as I remember I always used some red/purple looking automatic transmission fluid (ATF) in our d24-s and not the regular power steering fluid. What type (F?) and what brand should I buy? Thanks for confirming.

Sorry, I wrote alternator bushings by mistake, I meant power steering pump bushings -- must have been too tired when I first typed that message, I just went back and corrected it. :o 3 new PS pump bushings should be all you need, job is easy, just make sure you note carefully how all the bolts and nuts and washers are stacked and oriented when you take it apart (or better yet take some pictures beforehand), since the setup is different at each of the 3 attachment points and it's not always immediately obvious how it should go back together.

If the pump is seeping then resealing it at the same time as you do the bushings is a good idea, since a leak from that seal lets fluid run down onto your new rubber bushings and degrade them. (Unless you use the blue poly bushings that IPD sells, which are impervious to oil degradation -- but fixing the leak is still a good idea anyway.) :)

[RedArrow]

Thanks for all your info! I inspected the PS pump and noticed that the lower bushings are in bad shape, cracked and softened, deeply carved in. Especially the front one. That`s probably the reason that the belt is not aligned perfectly. The pump `went downwards` a little, tilting the assembly a bit, putting some extra pressure also on the upper bushing that came out of the hole towards the front of car 3-4mm. The front seal of the pump does leak in the middle area so I will have to get to Autozone asap and get the parts you suggested and do the rebuild. For now as an SOS solution I used the `turkey fluid extractor` :) and took old fluid out, replaced it with the proper atf. System does not have air in it, no bubbles visible but my steering is not Volvo-like so that tells me what`s going on. :) Drops on the ground, nothing major but I want this fixed and focus on other treats for the car. Oh btw I did fix the ignition switch as well, well that`s a long story but now it is back and working.

[RedArrow]

I took the 99cents turkey baster and got rid of the majority of fluid of the ps pump.
Filled it up with fresh DexronIII (Peak) ATF and watched for air bubbles after startup. I did not see any air coming out of the system but the steering is still not Volvo-like. After a few days the new ATF did stop 90% of the leak that was caused, I think, by the front seal of pump). I loosened all the ps mounting bushings too and moved the pump around, many times... and tightened them back. The lower bushings are worn, so I will have to replace those. After tightening the belt a bit and changing the position of the bushings (turning them slightly) did help some. I also put a foam-type thick ring on the pump`s `neck`, just under the cap to avoid effects&results of vibration and get some of that ATF held back if a possible leak does happen in the future. Now the belt is not that much misaligned any more but I`ll have to get the new ps mount bushings and also, I will order the kit and reseal the pump hopefully soon. When having this setup removed already, probably I should get a new belt too although it is not (yet) eaten on the edges. What`s the best/suggested/preferred type? Thanks!
Ps. I will flush the ps fluid ( =ATF) again tomorrow, that might help some.

[RedArrow]

Thanks!
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/Duralast-Power-Steering-Pump-Seal-Kit/1985-Volvo-765/_/N-iutqeZ8oyus?itemIdentifier=21419_0_0_
I`ll visit Autozone tomorrow to buy ball joints and various bushings for a friend`s es300. AutoZone's parts search is NOT so dieselVolvo friendly. Would this seal-kit work on the d24t Saginaw pump system??

[RedArrow]

Thanks!
http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/Duralast-Power-Steering-Pump-Seal-Kit/1985-Volvo-765/_/N-iutqeZ8oyus?itemIdentifier=21419_0_0_
Would this seal-kit work on the d24t Saginaw pump system??

A, Time flies! Still having the old seals yet, since they pretty much stopped leaking after I changed the fluid twice. Recently I just replaced the PS bushings again, the belt got aligned, etc. I`d like to order a new, proper belt too (it ran misaligned for some time). Pls send me a link.

B, Staring at the setup, I was just wondering, what happens when/IF the PS belt breaks. Of course you`ll notice/hear/feel that immediately; but is double-trouble possible there? The radiator hose is soo freaking close...it`s near the danger zone. Ideas&stories wanted.

[745 TurboGreasel]

One day my 6.2 Suburban sounded a little labored, then once I got to the top of the mountain and headed down the other side, it overcooled. That was odd, but I went to work and did my job. After work, I think 'I ought to take a peek'.
A little something shiny caught my eye, and there was the alternator belt completely tied in a big knot around the fan clutch:confused:
It took a long time to cut the belt out of the fan, but otherwise nothing was hurt. something to be said for vehicles that don't need much electronics.

[RedArrow]

I had time to do these 3 bushings again.

This time they aren`t the URO brand but made by REIN (sent by fcpeuro).

I didn`t see any crack on the bracket which is great news.
I took my time to clean the entire area. The unit leaks a little but it all adds up over time, right? I should `rebuild` it at some point (needs new internal seal).

The most annoying things always been that I could not get the freaking belt run completely straight and flush with the other pulley.
It always has been an issue on this car.

I figured a solution that worked. I think there was some warpage or substantial wear in the lower eyelets of the bracket.
The belt always ran misaligned, new belt and new bushings never fixed it either.

Today I grabbed a file and filed away at the upper hole, made it more straight and tried to figure the best and most efficient angle for a proper alignment of the belt.
At the upper hole I filed the most at the side of the hole which is closer to the engine (=passenger side of the bracket, right right of the car but left as you face cylinder 1). At this upper hole I filed the pass side much more than the driver side. I filed more at the top of the hole and a little at the bottom portion of the hole. I tried creating an angle and a slight tilt. Thinking about the force too that the tightened belt creates on that weak looking arm that holds the reservoir away from the engine.

Then I filed the bottom eyelet/hole and created the same angles by filing most at the top portion and concentrated on the left side of the hole which is the side closer to the engine (passenger side of the car)

By the time these two holes all seemed very much aligned and okay, I reinstalled the reservoir using the 3 new bushings, new washers where needed. I noticed that there are some sides where a washer would limit protrusion and deformation of a wearing bushing in case it wore too much the washer would `hold it in`and wouldnt let it completely deform and climb out of its own shape. I added some.

The project turned out to be really successful and I saw the aligned belt immediately after finishing the assembly.

All in all I probably had to file away 3mm at the very left of the upper hole , 2mm at the right side of same hole and about half of that at the bottom hole. I always adjusted the filing to the driver sides of the holes too but didnt file away much at all at the driver sides.
In my case the upper hole needed the most material taken away and it all became so great. It sits so nice and never been that aligned and holding strong and nearly zero vibration which wasnt the case even with the recent new bushings earlier. Grabbing the reservoir by the top and trying to force it out of the way but I could not. Super stubborn now, it improved by a lot. the front faces of those 3 holes were definitely not flush with each other. And all of that was visible.

What came out:
The old bushings that I removed were not completely toast but
the upper one was super hard and really deformed, took the shape of the wrong angle of the front face of the upper hole of the bracket.
The bottom two bushings were in bad shape too but not hardened rather they became too soft, prob worn away by fluid, mist of oil and atf that seeped out of the reservoir as fluid leak through several years.
The front bottom bushing was prob in the worst shape. The rear lower bushing was trying to hold but disintegrated and started to split around the larger edge. Created mostly by the pull caused by unnecessary misalignment.

By filing at the bracket I created a really nice angle that lets the belt stay aligned even if you overtightened the belt so much that it pulls super hard against the slotted adjusting bracket/arm (just a test).

This small touch up will definitely help it hold against the crazy vibration and heat we have under the hood.

Basically what I did was achieving a microscopic lol clockwise vertical `twist` in the reservoir vs the old position on the ps bracket... And a few degrees tilt at its top (towards the rear of the car) and some tilt at the bottom eyelet hole too, all of these obviously in synchro and level with each other. The changes are so minimal that it wont affect anything, instead it got so much better indeed, I wish i did this many years ago!

[Swallowedhook]

Tom Bryant in Maine is the guy most English go to as the D24T guru.
thosbryant@gmail.com / https://thosbryant.wordpress.com/ I'm new to the engine and was referred by an English guy. Tom will explain to you that the power steering bracket is poorly designed and most will fail eventually. He designed a new bracket and had it cast in aluminum and machined. He made 20 of them and spread the set up cost across those 20. Not cheap, but a permanent fix. He also rebuilds the cruise control spool so it is not subject to adverse vibration. Many many fixes on his blog. He replied to my newbie questions with 3 LONG emails, explaining concisely the issues causes, and fixes. For those who haven't read his blog, he's a great resource. He's an old fart like me. Got to pick the brains of these boomers so the info isnt lost to time....especially since the BOOMER DOOMER virus is stalking us old guys.
Best of luck!

[RedArrow]

[QUOTE=v8volvo;6236]
The fluid leak is probably a separate issue, very often on these old power steering pumps the main O-ring that seals the pump housing to the reservoir gets tired and starts to leak after a while. Fortunately it is quite easy to get parts to fix it since the pump is made by GM (Saginaw) and is shared with many GM vehicles from the '70s and '80s, hence extremely common.... CarQuest sells a pump rebuild kit for under $20 that is applicable for the D24 power steering pump, part # 35039, and replacing the seals is relatively easy especially if you already are going to have the pump removed to replace the mount bushings.
The kit comes with pump shaft bushings, etc as well but the pumps themselves seem to never have any issues at all, only the leaky seals so I have never used the bushings.[/QUOTE


Thanks for the info on the part number.
I found it as GATES 350390 and finally got it done because the reservoir usually looks `shiny and just a little wet` on the bottom area. A `leak` usually happens only in the Winters so I decided to do it in time. The kit has 12 or 13 parts in it, bushing and seals/o-rings etc as you mentioned.
I didn`t take the entire pump apart fully, I decided to leave it alone and only used up a couple of seals from the package, I think I used up only 5-6 rubber seals total.
The largest, main o-ring was the cause, I think. All orings were also hardened and kind of square-shaped or `flattened out`. The largest oring broke into 3 pieces when I inspected it... it was time for this reseal to get done.
Of course the rusty looking parts got cleaned up and painted, nothing should go back on the engine looking crap or oily.

I should`ve added a new PS belt too, but I was lazy to deal with the alternator belt (I use the tightening method you shared here to install&tighten it properly to avoid slipping). I didn`t run the engine while the PS system was taken apart and I did fill the reservoir back up right after finishing the job.

But now I still can`t get the air out and something is holding it from being bled out. :)
Maybe you have a trick or something? Am I missing the point here?

I followed this advice I found online, with no success. The fluid is topped off (warm engine) to the proper level. The annoying part is that when I did the reseal I haven`t really ran the car at all in the first place to get air in the system.

https://www.volvoclub.org.uk/faq/Steering.html#PowerSteeringFluidBleedingProcedure
I did what it suggests and had it done 2-3 times at least, for both sides, twice.
Then with the engine running. Then again, without much change at all. The fluid level rose a little bit when I did that first.
Maybe I should get the car on jacks to have it done easier.


I haven`t removed any components such as tie rod ends etc and IDK why it suggests doing that for the bleeding.
All I did was removing the reservoir for the reseal.
yes, it may have introduced air thru the two hoses but does it have to be so hard to get it out? Also IDK what type of rack this d24t has.

Ideas welcome and thank you.

( Is that magnet supposed to just simply be randomly floating around in there? )

[ngoma]

But now I still can`t get the air out and something is holding it from being bled out. :)
Maybe you have a trick or something? Am I missing the point here?

I followed this advice I found online, with no success. The fluid is topped off (warm engine) to the proper level. The annoying part is that when I did the reseal I haven`t really ran the car at all in the first place to get air in the system.

Did you try this? (from your link):

"Note: If the system is filled too quickly, the fluid can be prone to retaining air. Once this occurs, it can take one to two days of normal driving before the air is released from the system."

( Is that magnet supposed to just simply be randomly floating around in there? )
If it was just floating around in the fluid I'd say it has lost its magnetic charge. Throw it out and add some fresh ones. I use ones from my old Sonicare toothbrush heads. Extremely strong. Place them where they will have a good chance to entrap ferrous bits drifting by.

[RedArrow]

Did you try this? (from your link):

"Note: If the system is filled too quickly, the fluid can be prone to retaining air. Once this occurs, it can take one to two days of normal driving before the air is released from the system."


two days driving would take me to Key West! nice :))))) but driving a fish-tank without AC?!!!!! (=a 745)

but I know what they mean. :)

well, I`ll have no chance but to jack it up and help it out by a new test: redo it all by the same advice then do it again with engine running ... THEN wait and drive locally ``for two days``.

The magnet I found is still very sticky so I reused it but I was surprised that it wasn`t glued to any surface such as it is for example in the m46 bottom overdrive pan.
I thought of adding another, round, extremely strong magnet, one of those hematite looking halfmoon ones that one cant just grab off a fridge without prying.
I consider adding a filter into the line to see what it catches, I read an article that it works way better than flushing the system through. An inline filter caught a huge amount of stuff despite a flush being done earlier, for the guy who wrote that article about the small filter. He was surprised to see as much crap caught because he flushed twice. The old rack might appreciate this filter, IDK even if just temporarily for circa few hundred miles.

[RedArrow]

I followed that procedure over again, very very thoroughly at every step, with no success after a two hr 'job' (on jacks).
Is it possible that it now blew an internal older seal that hadnt been replaced? I used 6 parts only from the 12 piece kit. I highly doubt it blew an old seal but maybe.

What I dont doubt is me making a mistake at installation bc i was distracted by a vw golf full exhaust magnaflow installation project.

I wonder if my layout is correct bc that is how i put it all back in the pump. Anyone knows?

I suspect that #2 with the tiny filter (located in its left side in this picture) needs to be oriented the other way. Is that the case? It has a nut in its end and a mini filter.

I usually lay my stuff out at disassembly for picts but I may have confused myself with this one.

:-)

[v8volvo]

Interesting issue. I have never had one as far apart as you pictured since the pumps seem to almost never have trouble, only occasional leaks. I have never seen them need any of the other seals changed, just the external ones, though of course it is possible for other parts to fail.

Normally they will self bleed with very little effort after refilling fluid and turning the wheel all the way side to side a few times. Do you have another spare pump you could take apart and see how the small parts go together?

Or refer to these pages, fortunately these old style General Motors pumps are extremely common and used in millions and millions of vehicles so there are quite a few DIY pictorials out there for how they come apart and go back together, focused on other makes/models but the same principles will apply. There are lots of youtube videos also. Search for Saginaw power steering pump rebuild.

http://tc.wagoneer.org/2012/08/saginaw-power-steering-pump-rebuild.html

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/ccrp-1212-power-steering-fix-junkyard-builder/

https://www.mattsoldcars.com/RestoreAmerican/pspump.shtml

https://www.corvette-restoration.com/2006/08/13/power-steering-pump-rebuild/

[RedArrow]

Indeed, very interesting of a problem. I also thought and expected that it will slowly self-bleed over time and/or immediately if I assist.

Today I have a chance to give it another chance but i doubt it will self-heal. I am going on a favor taxi trip for family to and from airport, pickups and dropoffs on the way which will total at about 80miles on nyc local roads omg ughhhh so there will be quite some turning cornering etc... and as some of you know, it can -and prob will- take about 7-7.5 hrs of driving here which also considered being normal in nyc.

If the car still will not get back to at least somewhat better, i will pull it apart again and see, or grab a spare and take that apart for reference.
Thank you for the links, two of them i went thru a couple of days ago, and I based my repair on one of them, but looks like my issue developed for some (for now) unknown reason. Now i have a non-leaky bad system versus the leaky perfect steering I had earlier, before my reseal. :))

[ngoma]

two days driving would take me to Keywest! nice :))))) but driving a fish-tank without AC?!!!!! (=a 745)
They don't mean driving for two days straight (72 hrs.). ;)

The magnet I found is still very sticky so I reused it but I was surprised that it wasn`t glued to any surface such as it is for example in the m46 bottom overdrive pan.
The OD pan magnet is glued because the OD pan is aluminum! :D Non-magnetic surface. :D The magnets in the ZF auto are just stuck magnetically to the steel pan surface, as they are in the steel PS pump can. Some have been known to stick magnets on the outside, to help, without having to open it up to be able to place them inside.

[RedArrow]

They don't mean driving for two days straight (72 hrs.). ;)

I`m sure that would be even worse than 2 days :))

The OD pan magnet is glued because the OD pan is aluminum! :D Non-magnetic surface. :D

Yes I definitely did not think of this when I posted. Ridiculous! :)




ALSO,

If you look at the 5 illustrations, you can see something that (I think) is the problem.

Today alone, I drove 149 local miles, but my PS did not self-bleed. Time to time it felt like it caught up but: extremely rarely and for 2seconds only.
I noticed this also: When the engine revs up for the first start (at a coldstart), I can feel that there is some power assist for the steering but it lasts only for 2 seconds, 3 seconds maximum; then biceps needed again.


There is no leaking whatsoever, anywhere.
The low and high pressure hoses both look aged and have some visible chafing but no leaks.
Fluid level is constant and there are no bubbles when turned left or right.
When I turn wheel to full lock, I can hear the pump working. No struggles but I can hear it trying.

Okay. So, now, proceed by looking at my 5 illustrations above... :) and see the first two pictures to compare.
The damn o-ring sits in a different groove.
I think that`s the problem. ;)

At my assembly, to see and confirm how well (or if at all) the pin was seated, I pulled that pin out and pushed it back in once more, then I assembled everything. O-ring must have slipped into the secondary groove? yes I would guess so. :) And it was all in front of my eyes but I never spotted. Also, uploaded picts later... but never noticed.
The o-ring is blocking the orifice where fluid supposed to be freely traveling through. :mad:

I think I know what to do now. High pressure fitting off, grabbing the 1inch socket, pin out, move the oring or use a new one if damaged.

Thank you for the links and the detailed technical info. Many forumers will now do this fun&easy rebuild. Stakes arent high. :)

The next pump I will fully disassemble, spend some extra time for the internals (bushing etc) and use all 12 parts in the rebuild kit.


UPDATE and confirmation:
Yes, it was the o-ring that slipped into the wrong groove at installation.
Now it has new fluid once again. Power steering pump runs perfectly. Also it self-bled by itself in no time. No leaks, no weird sounds.